This place is is insane - the biggest complaint I hear in the Car Lounge is that VW's are too expensive when loaded up with options and yet when they want to decontent and lower the price, the complaints get even louder. You can't have it both ways.
I looked there . Didn't really answer my questions though. Will you have to buy an additive to put in the tanks to drive the car? How long does it last? Where do (will?) you buy it?
Yep... diesel lovers needs to show they are more than just talk.
I assume BMW will offer manual transmission with diesel?
Both will be auto only.
Modified by chewym at 4:56 PM 1-2-2008
Quote, originally posted by MEIN_VW »
This place is is insane - the biggest complaint I hear in the Car Lounge is that VW's are too expensive when loaded up with options and yet when they want to decontent and lower the price, the complaints get even louder. You can't have it both ways.
at least he says the torks will push you to 60 in 6.2 that's very fast for a diesel. It must be the additional torks, it bet it would just demolish crubs fentses burshes and sum bricks if you ever hit them.
Quote, originally posted by mavric_ac »
satisfied for carlounge president?
Quote, originally posted by Accidental L8 apex »
Why not? The current one doesn't make any sense either.
Hello, I'm satisfied. Vote for me America; because I believe that making sense does not make dollars. (this message paid for by the Sara Lee bagel company.)
at least he says the torks will push you to 60 in 6.2 that's very fast for a diesel. It must be the additional torks, it bet it would just demolish crubs fentses burshes and sum bricks if you ever hit them.
I'm not denying the utility of the BMW's ability to demolish crubs and/or fents - but I want to shift myself
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So a car the size of a freaking Civic gets a mere 23mpg in the city with a diesel? NOT impressive fuel economy. Thankfully it does perform well, but I would rather see the 2L diesels (not that it would happen in the US).
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Even if they do, these cars don't attract me. If I'm getting a BMW, I want one of their gas engines.
A diesel makes sense if you're in Europe where diesel is so much cheaper than gas. In America, where diesel is more expensive, buying this car makes zero sense, especially on a BMW. Not to mention all that adblue rubbish you have to keep up with.
I looked there . Didn't really answer my questions though. Will you have to buy an additive to put in the tanks to drive the car? How long does it last? Where do (will?) you buy it?
Yes, but if you RTFA, it's covered for 4 years/50,000 miles. The lifespan of an oil change, which on modern diesels, tends to be 10,000+ miles. BMW, Mercedes, Volkswagen, or Audi dealers. It should also become available from parts stores specializing in parts for those makes. Also, look for it to start appearing in truck stops, because some semi trucks are going to start using it.
I'm assuming that 335d engine is a 3.5 liter. Isn't that kinda...big? I mean the whole point is better fuel economy, right? It's not stellar fuel economy. I dunno, I guess I'm just more interested in something like a 2 liter diesel in a Mazda3 or something. But BMW isn't marketing to me, so like, whatever.
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Audi will (probably) show an R8 with a V12 TDI diesel.
Modified by chewym at 7:19 PM 1-3-2008
Quote, originally posted by MEIN_VW »
This place is is insane - the biggest complaint I hear in the Car Lounge is that VW's are too expensive when loaded up with options and yet when they want to decontent and lower the price, the complaints get even louder. You can't have it both ways.
And slow to get here. I was told last summer by a BMW dealer that these would be arriving in spring '08, not fall.
Quote, originally posted by gtivr4 »
So a car the size of a freaking Civic gets a mere 23mpg in the city with a diesel? NOT impressive fuel economy.
The Civic comparison is a bit unfair since these are six-cylinder diesels that are obviously aimed at performance and not fuel economy. But I agree that a more economy-minded version would be nice. I don't need 0-60 in 6.2 seconds. For a diesel, 8-9 seconds is perfectly adequate and it'd give way better MPG.
-Matt 7,001,084 Californians don't want me to have what they have.
I'm assuming that 335d engine is a 3.5 liter. Isn't that kinda...big? I mean the whole point is better fuel economy, right? It's not stellar fuel economy. I dunno, I guess I'm just more interested in something like a 2 liter diesel in a Mazda3 or something. But BMW isn't marketing to me, so like, whatever.
It's a 3.0 liter sequential turbo.
The point is better fuel economy without sacrificing (much) performance. That's the only way Americans will accept diesels, really. We want to have our cake (mmm, sweet diesel cake...) and eat it too.
The new BMW 120d, in turn, comes with an increase in output by 10 to 130 kW (177 hp) and an improvement in fuel economy of the same magnitude, the engine now making do with just 4.9 l/100km (48 mpg US).
The point is better fuel economy without sacrificing (much) performance. That's the only way Americans will accept diesels, really. We want to have our cake (mmm, sweet diesel cake...) and eat it too.
Sort of. I think people here will accept diesels if:
1. The MPG is at least 35% more than gasoline equivalent models. 2. The performance, such as 0-60, is no more than 2 seconds slower than gasoline equivalent models.
It looks like BMW shot for an even smaller sacrifice in performance which in turns means a somewhat unspectacular reduction in fuel consumption.
Don't know about other states but here in SoCal, diesel is often more expensive than super unleaded, so (w/o doing the math) drivers of a 335d here in SoCal might not actually see any noticeable savings in their wallets at all. Given, that, these cars just may fail here.
The mild-MPG gain and and little performance decrease combination might be fine for a few drivers but I think for diesel to really gain a foothold in the US, we need to see diesels of the "wow it gets great MPGs" coupled with "at least it can get out of its own way" performance. 0-60 in 6.2sec at the low MPG increases on the 335d isn't what we need to change the public's thinking in the US with respect to diesels. It's overkill on the acceleration and not enough on the fuel consumption reduction.
After all, didn't Honda in the past year kill off the Accord Hybrid because it was more of a "performance" hybrid that had only small gains in MPG? BMW could be heading for the same fate with these cars here.
Modified by gti_matt at 9:40 PM 1-2-2008
-Matt 7,001,084 Californians don't want me to have what they have.
I think you will see better real world fuel economy increase than the EPA indicates.
Car and Driver compared the 330d and 330i. The diesel got 38 mpg, while the gasoline 330i only got 26.
Also, the same 228 hp version only took 6 seconds to get to 60.
Quote, originally posted by MEIN_VW »
This place is is insane - the biggest complaint I hear in the Car Lounge is that VW's are too expensive when loaded up with options and yet when they want to decontent and lower the price, the complaints get even louder. You can't have it both ways.
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. Didn't really answer my questions though. Will you have to buy an additive to put in the tanks to drive the car? How long does it last? Where do (will?) you buy it?
